Friday, January 23, 2009

Suggestion #5 Dutch? What A Novel Idea! by EQP

Go·ing Du·tch a thing girls do to let guys know they like them.

Pronunciation: \gō-iŋ \dəch\

Definition: when a female bears the financial burden for her half of a date.

So you like a boy. What do you do? Try going Dutch. Not on the first date, silly. He'll think you're hinting this isn't a date, at all. But on the second date, when the check comes or you both approach the register, take that plastic out of your little Gucci handbag and tell him you'll pick up his half if he'll pick up yours ;)

It works quite well. Men respond to incentives and two in particular: physical and financial ones. This blog's PG-13, so we'll skip to the financial types. If you want date number three, provide a financial incentive: Go Dutch! What this says to us guys is that we don't need to break our piggy bank to woo you. We dig that. Its about the best thing you can do early on, other than knocking us a little goodnight kiss or two(…). Going Dutch also tells us that you're probably not that high maintenance, fairly level-headed, reasonable, and independent (so attractive).

And for you cultural conscious donne, it's in vogue, too. They're doing it all over Europe including Italy— pagare alla Romana. So, ladies, when you like a guy, pay as they do in Rome, Go Dutch!


  1. I think you just must be a little cheap…because guys I dated seemed to take offense to this sort of thing. I always tried from the first few dates to pay at least the tip…no one ever let me. I use to try “At least let me get the movie, you paid for dinner”…nope, never. Girls really do feel bad when the guy shells out tons of cash…especially if the girl thinks she makes more than they do. Ok maybe not MOST girls, but I did. But even though I do not agree on this suggestion because of my own past experiences I love this blog. I am so glad I came upon it. I have been laughing for days.

  2. Diddo. Most times I try to go Dutch the guy gets awkward and insists. And I've had guys tell me it sends the message that we are too head strong and feminist and it takes away their manliness. I think just suggesting places to eat or things to do that are inexpensive sends the message that you're not high mainentance.

  3. This discussion reminds me of the discussions I've heard about the 90/10 phenomenon. Many people from singles wards complain that 90% of the dating is done by 10% of the group. Furthermore, the women often say that guys "freak out" when they try to be friends with them, thinking that if you are seen talking to them more than 3 times it means you are dating and next thing they will be dragged to the altar. Since I'm female I don't really know what the guys' side of the argument is. However as one comedian said recently "men talk, but you know [they're] just lying to each other".

    Both men and women in the singles wards are at fault in my opinion. Women are their own worst enemy because many of them have become so aggressive that the men have to do little in order to get attention. I've lost track of how many times a new person comes into the ward and the girls rush them to the point where they just have to show up. Almost no effort is required on their part to start conversations because the women do all the work. Ladies, I hate to be so hard on members of my own sex, but here it is. Lay off! Let the men make the first move and then when you are in a relationship, they will be more likely to make the moves you want just because that's what they had to do in order to get your attention in the first place.

    Now back to the 90/10 problem. In my opinion there are far too many ward and singles activities. If 90% of the dating is done by only a small fraction of the group, one would have to ask why. I believe that it has to do with how easy it is for people to show up to an activity and meet 10's if not 100's of singles at a variety of activities from movies to singles conferences or devotionals. All a guy (or girl for that matter) has to do is show up to one of these activities and chat with a few people or participate in a couple of activities in order to feel like they are playing the game. And who wouldn't take an opportunity like this? There's very little effort involved, almost no cost and minimal pressure. If you don't like who you are talking with, you can move on in under 4 minutes, just like with speed dating. I have to laugh about the number of guys I've seen who didn't date much and then they became too old for the singles ward and after they got "kicked out", then within less than 6 months they were married!!

    another problem in the singles environment is gossip. One time someone asked me if I was dating a certain guy. I replied that I wasn't and asked why the question. It turned out this person thought I was dating so-and-so just because we were on the same team at a miniature golf activity and were talking to each other most of the time. In reality I had only just met the guy, I had no interest in him and no one else ended up on own team. Another time my hometeacher told me people were gossiping that we were dating and that it was because we were seen talking to each other more than 3 times. If people learned to live their own lives instead of gossiping about others' then perhaps we would see the dating scene improve.


    "The Phantom Kisser"

  4. Love this blog! You guys are great, however I need some advice... I wouldn't call myself overweight but I was not comfortable with my body, so I decided to do something about it. I've been eating really healthy since Thanksgiving and I feel great. I have a hard time though when I'm eating around guys on a date or just in general. Some give me a hard time and I know a lot of guys say they HATE it when girls just pick at a salad when they take them to dinner; but I also know they'd perfer a healthy, fit girl to take to dinner. How exactly do I handle this, especially on dates? I dread when a guy says "Let's go get some ice cream!" Any advice?

  5. i agree with most of your blog. But on this one...I think you are just being cheap. It is our job (apparently) to look, smell, and dress good... as well as put out. The least you can do is pay the 10 bucks at Pei Wei. I guess that could be reason #1 mormon guys stay single... They are cheap.

  6. I think the person that made that super long comment needs to just start their own blog.

  7. What is with all the anonymous comments? Own your comments people!

    This blog is a riot! Please keep them coming.

    But really, dutch on a second date? You're living in fantasy land, my friend.

  8. I personally would like to say that I'm one of those 10% who dates all the time and I will NEVER date a guy who lets a girl pay for ANYTHING. In my opinion, it's a great sign of respect when a guy pays for a girl, regardless of whether they're just "friends" hanging out in a big group or on their 90th date.

  9. What do you girls find so objectionable about the notion of a woman choosing to pay her own way on a date? We don't live in the age of chivalry anymore ladies. On average women make just about as much money as men do. So, while you're still single why should the guy pay every time, especially if you like the dude?

  10. I disagree with the dutch idea. Dutch is for not-dates. If I ask a girl out, I want to show her I am capable of providing for both of us, or at least budgeting to make it look like I can. I want to be the man, that's why I asked out a woman.

    I do love it when, after at least three dates, a girl invites me out to dinner or some activity where she pays entirely. I feel great when that happens, but only after I've taken her out a few times.

    Yeah guys, we have to spend money on dates. It's a lot, sometimes, and can be frustrating, but that may just be what it takes to find the girl of your dreams. Go big or go home!

    Wonder Boy

  11. I absolutely love your blog and my sping chicken daughter thinks it is a riot as well as being very informative ;)

    I do take issue, slightly, with the dutch-treat thing.

    I agree that it should be reserved for a "we're just friends" outing. If you don't like her enough to pay, why are you asking her out?

    Anyway, thanks for the daily laugh. Keep 'em coming!

  12. Although it is a nice idea, and a pleasant offer, I don't like to allow my date to pay for anything.
    If she asked me on the date that is one thing, but if I extended the invitation, I feel that it is my responsibility to pay.
    I'm not sure if its a curse or a blessing, but I have four older sisters that try so hard to get me married.
    I had a lot of time when I was younger listening to the complaints they had after dates, and I hope I learned from them. Often a sister would complain about the guy expecting her to pay, or not having enough to pay so that she was then forced to.
    I vowed to never allow that to happen on any of my dates. I stand with some of the Relief Society on this one. Come on guys, fork it out.

  13. I Make More Than You AnywayJanuary 27, 2009 at 9:55 AM

    I'm a little surprised at these answers. While, I think the guy should expect to pay for the first date or two if he's the one asking, there is nothing wrong with a girl pitching in down the line. Relationships are expensive to maintain. If I like you, I don't want you to go broke trying to show you like me. Believe it or not Big Spender, it's a big turnoff to see a fellow that is so determined on blowing so much dough to keep me entertained. It comes off as a little financially irresponsible and far too macho-man. I want to feel like the relationship is a partnership, so let me pick up the tab every once in a while.

  14. I agree with Wonder Boy - if a guy is concerned about spending money he just needs to get creative and plan a date that doesn't cost much. Believe me, girls won't be offended by a low cost date (and if she is, is she really the kind of girl you want to live with as you go through grad school?) I actually get really uncomfortable when a guy spends a lot on me, and if he does it frequently I start to question his fiscal habits.

    I'm all for planning and paying for dates once a relationship gets underway, but there's something in a guy planning and paying for a date that indicates an earnest interest.

  15. Rebuttal time from E.Q.P.

    @ Wonder Boy: How does spending the equivalent of 4 hours worth of a minimum wage paycheck amount to showing a woman you can provide?

    @ Wepill and Melanie: The post never mentions anything about a guy expecting a girl to pay her way. It only suggests a girl interested in a guy—specifically with whom she's already been out—can show increased interest in him by going Dutch in round two.

    @ Anonymous #7: "I will NEVER date a guy who lets [me] pay for anything?" hhmmm...given that money is so inherent to your relationships, is your date/boyfriend/husband buying your reciprocation, intimacy, sex?

    @ Natalie: women go Dutch with men at all points in a relationship, even in rounds one and two. And yes, I'm enjoying reality in my fantasyland ;)

    @ I Make More Than You Anyway: Right you are. There are about half a grand of daily male readers who would really like to go out with you now.

  16. This was an issue on my first date with my now husband. I wanted to be prepared to pay and at least offer, he refused, I allowed him to pay and we ended up taking turns shortly after that. And still do to this day. We're married the money comes from the same place, but we still both take turns paying because it feels nice to take care of the other person. I don't think that these hilarious yahoos are asking to much for a girl to ante up after a date or two.

  17. I'm sorry but when i take a girl on a date be it ice cream, dinner and a movie/play, dinner then dancing I will pay for everything because I asked HER. However if she asks me typically its who ever asks pays right? WRONG! in my books I will go dutch if i am asked by the girl. If she refuses to let me pay my share I will push it a little bit but not to the point of being overbearing. thats the rules i stick by.

    For the ladies reading this... When a guy takes you on a date most guys will never under no circumstances let you pay for anything. ex. one of my ex's gave me money to cover her half of the date once. I knew her well enough that she would never take the 20 back. so i did what any sensible guy should do in this situation... Needless to say the next time she saw me i was refusing to take back the 20 i slipped into her purse. that being said It is a wonderful compliment to a guy for his date to offer to help pay. It tells us that you respect our financial situations and shows that you aren't there for just a free meal. So offer it's nice and polite. but don't be surprised when we politely decline to let you pay.

    and guys that are reading what i did... have some fun with the offer if you can. at the very least she's not going to forget you anytime soon...

  18. sorry i forgot something this is directed over to one of the anonymous comments above... the one about chivalry... CHIVALRY IS NOT DEAD! While I draw breath i guarantee you I will pay for the dates unless the girl puts up a huge stink about it, I do and will always open doors AND hold them open for other people whether they be guys or girls. As I said chivalry will not die until i die... and if i can manage it i will make sure my kids carry on that grand tradition... oh and girls? let the guy open the door for you. nay if you're on a date make him open the car door for you. but make sure you unlock his door... its really not that hard. its all respect guys come on!

  19. Thank you, Deuce! And might I also add that I appreciate it when my date takes a moment to close my door behind me after I get in the car. Not that I can't do it myself, but it is a gesture that speaks of kindness and respect.

  20. its amazing how we are supposed to live in the world but not of the world and yet we still stoop to the lower standards of dating that the world considers high

  21. As for the Anonymous person who says that the #1 reason why mormon guys stay single is because they're cheap, well, let me just say... AMEN to that sista!! Chivalry is dead! If I were on a date, I would pay, who the fudge cares? Does this bruise your ego, guys? Look, you ask us out and then you pick us up and take us to whatever movie or restaurant... so why not give us the fair share and let us pay. Really, I don't care. I'll just presume that the guy is cheap so if he insists on paying, I'll let him have it the next date... that is if he wasn't offended by what I did.

  22. Hell yes he's buying the sex! I'm good at what I do, and I'm worth every penny.

  23. I remember offering after we got into a relationship and my guy was still deeply
    offended - and I did make more dollars at the time. There were plenty of ways to make up
    for that though. Plenty.

  24. I'm not going Dutch until I get the label of "girlfriend." I will suggest going somewhere cheaper that doesn't cost much, but the 3rd date is too soon to go dutch. If you expect a girl to believe you are really invested in her by the 3rd date you haven't dated much. The third date is the beginning still and you are still being the man.

    If you expect women to pay for you on the 3rd date you should hand over your testicles right now. You haven't earned them.

  25. The ONLY time I ever offer to pay for a date is if I am not interested in a romantic relationship. Girls starve and kick our butts at the gym and have to do and be all these things - SO much more than is expected of a guy, the least you can do is treat us like ladies. And it's not about money. Go for cheaper dates or alternate between free and other stuff - but MAN UP FELLAS!

  26. Hilarious HinterJune 11, 2009 at 2:46 PM

    So one of my guy friends asked me out and we went out a couple of times- he paid for everything. I wasnt interested in dating him any longer but I enjoyed spending time with him and we were still friends so I thought I might send him a hint by telling him "If we are going to continue to hang out I want to pay for myself" A few weeks later he started to DTR (defining the relationship) and said he wanted to date me exclusively. I was completely shocked. He hadnt tried to hold my hand or kiss me or anything and I was under the impression that we were just friends (I have a lot of guy friends that I just hang out with like this). But apparently I was sending the wrong message and no wonder he wanted to date me exclusively- he finally found a girl paying her own way! ha ha ha.